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Preview: Comments on CreationEvolutionDesign: Bogus: Shroud of Turin? #5: Pollen on the Shroud f...

Comments on CreationEvolutionDesign: Bogus: Shroud of Turin? #5: Pollen on the Shroud from plants native only to the Middle East and Turkey





Updated: 2015-07-03T15:59:59.827+08:00

 



Wayne >I have my doubts about the Shroud. T...

2010-10-25T20:55:21.235+08:00

Wayne

>I have my doubts about the Shroud.

Thanks for your comment.

>My Bible says Peter and John went into the tomb and saw the "strips" of linen that wrapped Chist's body

As I responded to a similar a comment on my The Shroud of Turin blog:

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As leading evangelical Christian theologian Dr. Gary Habermas (and others) has demonstrated in his two co-authored books, "Verdict on the Shroud" (1981) and "The Shroud and the Controversy" (1990), the Shroud is perfectly in harmony with the Gospel accounts of Jesus burial (as well as His suffering, death and resurrection), when the data in all four Gospels is carefully considered, especially in the original Greek. The "strips of linen" in Lk 24:12; Jn 11:44; 19:40; 20:5-6 is a mistranslation by the NIV in being too specific when the underlying Greek words can just mean linen cloths. The KJV more correctly translates those same verses by the more general "linen clothes" and "graveclothes." The NASB translates those verses as "linen wrappings." The NLT of those same verses has "linen wrappings" and "graveclothes" and "long sheets of linen cloth."

Also the NIV is at variance with Jewish burial customs, where bodies were enfolded in a shroud not wound around in strips or bandages like an Egyptian mummy. The only strips that were used in Jewish burials are those tying the hands, feet and jaw, to keep them in place before rigor mortis set in. That is probably what is meant in Jn 11:44 where Lazarus was still bound by those linen strips, but it does not mean (or say) that he was otherwise naked, which he would be if those strips were all that he was wearing.

See my 2007 post "Bogus: Shroud of Turin? #1" and Does the Shroud Contradict the Gospels?.
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>and the burial cloth that was wrapped around his head, folded and lying separately from the strips, but I've never heard anybody with common sense ever mention it.

Then you have never read a book on the Shroud that deals with these issues.

>Speaking of common sense, if that image was real, say that person passed through the cloth, the hair wouldn't look like a portrait, it would probably be close to the head.

Jesus' hair would have been stiff with blood from the crown of thorns. And it would have been moved aside by the strip of linen tied around the jaw and top of the head of a Jewish body to stop the mouth falling open. Also, the Shroud image may have been formed when Jesus' had been resurrected and was standing upright. A Dr Gilbert R. Lavoie has written a book, "Resurrected: Tangible Evidence That Jesus Rose from the Dead" (2000) based on the way the Shroud man's hair appears to hang vertically.

>Just saying....

I have started a series on my The Shroud of Turin blog, titled "Shroud of Turin: Burial Sheet of Jesus!." As its Index states, that will include "#4 Bible" and "#9 Objections" which will deal more fully with those issues that you and others have raised.

Stephen E. Jones



I have my doubts about the Shroud. My Bible says ...

2010-10-25T08:23:44.211+08:00

I have my doubts about the Shroud. My Bible says Peter and John went into the tomb and saw the "strips" of linen that wrapped Chist's body and the burial cloth that was wrapped around his head, folded and lying separately from the strips, but I've never heard anybody with common sense ever mention it. Speaking of common sense, if that image was real, say that person passed through the cloth, the hair wouldn't look like a portrait, it would probably be close to the head. Just saying....