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recursion -

Last Build Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 19:02:47 GMT


True or FalseCindytalk - Choked I

Tue, 02 Oct 2007 19:02:47 GMT

One of the keys to understanding the nature of things is to let go of the dichotomy of true and false. Just because something is a lie or is false does not make it any less true. Just because something is the truth does not make it any less a lie. That which has never been has always existed. Paradoxes are not paradoxes when one sees that truths can contradict each other because they are also lies.

Reality Hacking with Quantum Immortalitymazzy purring

Sat, 28 Apr 2007 21:23:57 GMT

I've been thinking about quantum immortality and how, if true, it could be used to manipulate one's experienced universe. For example, entity X cannot live without entity Y, so entity X creates a device that will insure their death if entity Y should die. From entity X's point of view, no outcome where entity X themselves die can occur -- as a result entity Y will never die in entity X's experienced universe.

With such trigger devices it would be able to manipulate an experienced universe to the desires of the experience. The trigger devises would have to be infallible, and that is quite a large hurdle to clear for any wholesale manipulation. Imperfect, though perhaps satisfactory, results might be found if the trigger device is significantly less probable to fail than the desired event is to not happen. Of course if the quantum immortality hypothesis is incorrect, the trigger devices will simply kill the user.

Absolute Truthbudgies gurgling

Thu, 15 Mar 2007 19:22:01 GMT

There is only one absolute truth, and that is "There is only one absolute truth."

New Communitybudgies in conference

Fri, 10 Mar 2006 18:00:55 GMT

geek: (n) a person who is fascinated, perhaps obsessively, by obscure or very specific areas of knowledge and imagination.

nerd: (n) a person who is perceived to be of above-average intelligence and whose interests are not shared by mainstream society.

(image) icon_geekery: (n) a place for geeks and nerds to find and/or post geeky and nerdy icons.

2055lake playing the violin

Fri, 30 Dec 2005 00:35:59 GMT

I will only make one prediction about what the world will be like in 50 years: it will not be like anyone predicts.


Fri, 16 Dec 2005 08:37:01 GMT

I'm the new maintainer of this community.

Continue as you were.

Or indeed continue moreso.

Or however you see fit, really.

Then go here.

New Maintainer Wantedbudgies gurgling

Mon, 12 Dec 2005 16:23:56 GMT

I have decided to hand over maintainership of this community to someone else. If you are interested in running this community, please reply to this post.

Fine tuning leads to radio silence

Mon, 31 Oct 2005 06:36:35 GMT

I think I have a fundamental grasp on zen, and also on the loss of ones ego.
Nothing is important, least of all myself, but least of all to myself, I am important.
I am rather cut off from myself. I'm not sure whether its a flaw or a virtue.
And of course, since I am so unimportant, it is only reasonable that I have a livejournal so as to bitch about my problems. It is also reasonable that you each pay me 10 shiny new pesos, and elect me as emperor. Just hurry up people, my worthless time is wasting.

Icons of the Madtraffic

Mon, 10 Oct 2005 00:33:21 GMT

(image) spiralicons is a new community is for mentally ill LiveJournal denizens to find icons and to display icons that they have made relating to mental illness. All aspects of mental illness are relevant. We speak madness here. Run by the same person who brought you (image) recursion.

The Onion always cheers me up.

Fri, 23 Sep 2005 16:33:45 GMT

Study: Majority Of Americans Out Of Touch With Mainstream

July 21, 2004 | Issue 40•29

NEW YORK—According to a study published by the Popular Culture Research Group Monday, the majority of American citizens are out of touch with mainstream American society.

"We're not sure, at this point, whether this is a new trend or a continuation of an old trend," PCRG consultant Paul Van Lamm said. "All we know right now is that 70 to 85 percent of Americans are unfamiliar with, unaware of, or just plain don't care about what the American people are watching on television, seeing at the movie theater, listening to on their radios, wearing, rooting for, falling in love with all over again, or downloading."

According to Van Lamm, 71 percent of U.S. citizens polled had no interest in NASCAR racing, America's fastest-growing sport. Van Lamm added that 69 percent of poll respondents said they did not have a single Hispanic friend, in spite of the fact that Hispanics are the nation's fastest-growing minority group. Additionally, the majority of poll respondents did not see the final episode of Friends, television's most-watched sitcom.

"It's disturbing," Van Lamm said. "I'm uncomfortable with the number of U.S. citizens who have no interest in what interests the greater part of their fellow citizens."

A scene from NBC's Will & Grace, a TV show about which many Americans care surprisingly little.

Additional data collected by prominent forecasters, pollsters, and trend-watchers indicates that an overwhelming number of Americans have not seen this week's box-office smashes; do not own a Munsingwear penguin-logo golf shirt, the country's hottest fashion item; and not only do not own the must-have Apple iPod, but have never even participated in the runaway fad of downloading the nation's top albums, many of which they've never heard.

Interviews with average Americans seem to support such findings.

"Kanye West? He's in one of those shows. Or was in. It's off the air now, is that it?" said Pewaukee, WI resident and HVAC technician Carl Danford. "Huh... DaVinci Code, you say. I know: Is it a movie? What's Nordic Walking? I mean 'who.' Who is Nordic Walking?"

"I know The White Stripes is a band that younger people like," Danford added.

When asked to name the latest and most buzzworthy figures in entertainment, Tempe, AZ daycare provider Tina Jefferson said, "A lot of the children here saw the Harry Potter movie. And Yao Ming plays sports. How is that?"

"Oh, wait!" Jefferson added. "I know that Anna Nicole Smith lost a lot of weight and people are talking about it. Well, not me or people I know, but other people."

Carson Mannheim, lead statistician and founder of Mannheim Media Research, said he is trying to make sense of the confusing data.

"We're unsure exactly what these figures may mean, but the implications must be far-reaching," Mannheim said. "We're used to Americans not knowing the capital of the next state over, or who their congressman is, or how a bill becomes a law. But the idea that most residents of this country don't know anything about 'Fit But You Know It,' Usher, Dragonball Z, or the WWE is terrifying. No one seems to care that these are the things that influence the everyday life of most Americans."

Recursive directories

Mon, 08 Aug 2005 22:50:34 GMT

Something tells me this shouldn't be a valid directory on any computer:

H:\Private\MATHLAB\Desktop\IFS Home\Private\MATHLAB\Desktop\IFS Home\Private\MATHLAB\Desktop\IFS Home\Private\MATHLAB\Desktop\IFS Home\Private\MATHLAB\Desktop\IFS Home\Private\MATHLAB\Desktop\IFS Home\Private\...

(As far as I can tell, it can just keep going.)

Fri, 08 Jul 2005 22:11:49 GMT

Open all doorways and follow me through the halls of dementia, where you can find a reason without reasonability, and follow a dream from point A to point B without ever passing through the long middle. We can all find a point without a place, and live their throughout our long happy lives until only the maggots delight in our hollow company. We are the brotherhood without arms, reaching out to each other in the long dusty night.
...But I would much rather sit down and put on a party hat.
Would anybody like some candy?

Apologies if this is old hat, but:

Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:52:21 GMT

To understand recursion, you must first understand recursion-1.

Recursive phrase structure rules

Wed, 03 Mar 2004 22:20:34 GMT

I don't know where I heard it, but I think I remember someone on Livejournal once saying that, chances are, any sentence you make with simple words that have existed for awhile is going to express the same meaning as some sentence previously uttered in the history of mankind. After all, we've had language for something like 100,000 years, and that's a lot of talking. Most senseful combinations of simple concepts have probably been covered.

Obviously this statement is bullshit, though, because it was made with no restriction on the length of a sentence. There are a couple very simple phrase structure rules in English that are recursive and thus allow for infinitely long sentences. Take, for instance, the following rules:

Sentence -> Noun + Verb (Phrase)
Verb Phrase -> Verb + Sentence

And combine them with the following words:

knew - verb
he - noun
I - noun

You can keep adding a level on top to get an infinite sequence:

I knew.
He knew [I knew].
I knew [he knew [I knew]].
He knew [I knew [he knew [I knew]]].

And even though an infinitely long sentence cannot have sensible meaning in English, a sentence of the above form of any arbitrarily large (even) number of words can be unraveled, complex as it may be. So to make absolutely sure you're uttering something never said before, simply count up the number of words ever spoken in human history, and apply the pair of recursive rules that many times, and you'll get a sentence with twice as many words as have been cumulatively spoken in the past 100,000 years, so obviously that sentence has never been uttered before.

What I want to know is if there are any languages with complex enough word-formation rules to allow for a *meaningful* single word longer than any arbitary number of syllables...

Thinking ThoughtsFairies Fortune - Stay with Me

Thu, 30 Oct 2003 02:17:56 GMT

you can feel thought. thought is all around you. that's what you're touching. the universe is made up of thoughts. you are thinking this whole thing up right now. if it weren't for you having thoughts you wouldn't be reading this thought. you parse this thought. you consider it's meanings and therefore you are thinking this thought.

Sat, 25 Oct 2003 08:31:18 GMT

(image) ontology

That's recursion for ya. I'm roflmao about that one.

How about that recursion?

Fri, 24 Oct 2003 08:41:41 GMT

Sure. I'll talk about something. Despite being either not here or not a person.

I've been looking for real world examples of recursion. Not code, not contrived examples, not simple circular definitions, but naturally occurring instances of recursion that might be used to explain recursion by example.

Anyone, (or no one), got any, (or none)?

So let me get this straight..

Fri, 24 Oct 2003 07:57:18 GMT

There are people here, who say there are no people here; despite the fact that there must be people here, otherwise there would be no people here to say there are no people here.

Which really begs the question.. are the people who claim they aren't here, but seem to be here to say they aren't here; interested in talking about anything aside from them not being here (which they aren't; otherwise they wouldn't be talking about not being here)?


Wed, 22 Oct 2003 21:34:09 GMT

Is there anybody out there?

Word salad?

Sat, 06 Sep 2003 22:50:36 GMT

Is word salad welcome here?

While not exactly logical rollercoasters, it's damned close. More like logical whippets, I'd think.

Religious debate/discussion

Tue, 08 Jul 2003 00:28:46 GMT

Hi all,

I'd like to invite anyone interested to (image) questionofgod

For the discussion of Christianity.

(Open to all, regardless of faith or lack of, to voice your thoughts, opinions and questions etc).

Note to maintainer: If you'd like me to remove this promotion, lemme know :)

Purpose of Life

Mon, 16 Jun 2003 14:25:59 GMT

A few years ago, I wrote an article for a journal in my college. The
topic was "Purpose of Life." At the time, most of my readers do not
have the mindset of a philosopher. As a result, I did not get any
useful response.

Since this is a crowd of thinkers, I am giving it for a try. Hopefully,
I can get some interesting responses. Note that this is a copyrighted

Here is the article:

We are born, go to schools, grow up and get a job. Some of us get
married; some of us have better career; some of us die in a early age;
some of us live to be one hundred; some of us know exactly what they
are doing; some of us just don't care anything but live. Is there a
purpose of what we have done, what we are doing, and what we are going
to do? Does life have a purpose?

Well, everybody has different answer to this question. There are
many answers: "to learn", "to be happy", "to be cool", "sex", "to do
something great", "to change history", "to be wired to the Internet",
"It doesn't exist", etc. God, that sounds complicated. Why don't we
make it simple? Let's just define purpose of life as "to find the
purpose of life".

Probably it explains a lot about suicide. Why do people kill
themselves? Because the purpose of life is to find the purpose of life.
By this definition, people will try to find the purpose of life, and
some will get frustrated and doubt the existence of the purpose of
life. Since they have no better things to do, they just kill

In fact, this definition is a recursion - meaning defining
something in term of itself, which implies a paradox. Let's think this
way. When you say the purpose of life is to find the purpose of life,
you have already found the purpose of life, so you don't have to find
the purpose of life. Therefore, you don't have to define the purpose
of life at the first place because you have found it. However, if you
don't define the purpose of life this way at the first place, you will
not conclude that you know the purpose of life.

You might say defining purpose of life in term of itself basically
says nothing about the purpose of life, so life is void of purpose.
Well, if you say that, then you have to prove it. To prove it, you
have to try to find the purpose of life until you find none. Since you
are doing this in your life time, it becomes a purpose of your life;
thus, it is false to say "life is void of purpose."

Defining purpose of life as "to find the purpose of life" seems
simple but confusing. Sometimes you can run into a loop. But it does
disproves the statement "life is void of purpose." So after all life
does have a purpose and you just have to find it.

Fri, 14 Mar 2003 13:05:43 GMT

any really involved physicists who are experimenting/studying
time travel & multi- dimensional theories... I would really
like to hear what you say. I've posted some relevant stuff on my journal ;-)

NihilismCindytalk - Landing

Sun, 15 Dec 2002 01:02:20 GMT

If there is no point to anything, what is the point of believing there is no point to anything? Why not just believe there might be a point?

Here comes the compulsionCoil - Strange Birds

Fri, 08 Nov 2002 00:15:21 GMT

All of humanity may be acting based upon one common concept or thought. Perhaps then we possess differences because our being is a unique filtering system that has the capacity to distort that singular conception. If that were true, then it's possible that the purpose of life is to demonstrate the degree to which we our filter forces us to drift off center in relation to the nose of that motivating force. Think of a running child holding a certain quantity of balloons, each attached to a separate string. The child is the concept, the hand he holds the strings in is the "nose," and the balloons represent individuals. The balloons wouldn't follow is hand single file or unified as one balloon, instead they would billow about from wind resistance, which symbolizes will or fate. The metaphor isn't perfect but I think it illustrates my thought.